The Polygraph Place

Thanks for stopping by our bulletin board.
Please take just a moment to register so you can post your own questions
and reply to topics. It is free and takes only a minute to register. Just click on the register link


  Polygraph Place Bulletin Board
  Professional Issues - Private Forum for Examiners ONLY
  Voice Stress Material Available

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Voice Stress Material Available
Dan S
Member
posted 03-11-2009 07:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dan S   Click Here to Email Dan S     Edit/Delete Message
Hello Donna:

I had read somewhere that Utah was having some issues with the idea of CVSA being introduced and wanted something from the APA to help.

Several years ago, the APA and AAPP put together a brochure called Truth vs Myth. There is some good information which is still relevant and was apporved by both associations.

I was recently at the APA National Office and came across a number of these brochures so if you or anyone else would like some of these brochures to send out to law enforcement agencies, please let me know. There are enough to go to every law enforcement agency in Utah.

You could also enclose a letter that refers to some of the most recent data about the research concerning CVSA and the layered voice stress.

Thanks

Dan Sosnowski
APA President-Elect

IP: Logged

Taylor
Member
posted 03-11-2009 09:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taylor   Click Here to Email Taylor     Edit/Delete Message
Dan, I am the one that emailed APA about the possibilities of sending out a letter to all of Utah Law Enforcement Agencies under the name of APA. The UPA felt it would carry more weight than 20 members of the UPA trying to get rid of competition. I have been talking to Gougler and I’m developing a letter that can be reviewed by APA’s attorney to assure there are no liability issues.

CVSA is taking over in Utah - numerous LEO's have gone to CVSA. We have about 25 polygraph examiners and about 50 CVSA people (who by the way don’t have to be licensed- but that is another issue). A few years back I had asked for help from APA about sending letters to LE Chiefs rather than spending money on educating the entertainment agency. I believe educating LE’s and research are the best options we have for our profession.

I would definitely like 75-100 of the myth brochures to assist us in this process. If they are still available please send to:

Donna Taylor
PO Box 671
Bountiful, Utah 84011

Thanks

IP: Logged

sackett
Moderator
posted 03-11-2009 10:21 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sackett   Click Here to Email sackett     Edit/Delete Message
Donna,

Including a listing of lawsuits which have been brought against CVSA users/dept's, and their financial impacts/losses from those suits; would have a more serious impact on the decision makers. Someone out here must be keeping a listing.

Just arguing the polygraph being better and more accurate is not going to work against the tide of CVSA proponents and their sales gimmicks.

My $.02


Jim

IP: Logged

Taylor
Member
posted 03-11-2009 01:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taylor   Click Here to Email Taylor     Edit/Delete Message
I was just reviewing APAs site on the CVSA and it has a lot of good research documents/info but nothing that lists law suits on CVSA.

Does anyone have or know who may have a list of law suits on CVSA?

IP: Logged

Taylor
Member
posted 03-11-2009 01:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taylor   Click Here to Email Taylor     Edit/Delete Message
Also, if anyone would like to share anything they have previously prepared regarding CVSA that is not posted at APA or AAPP - any type of documents similar to this...or...any power point presentations - please forward them to me @ quest4truth@msn.com

Thanks Donna

IP: Logged

Ted Todd
Member
posted 03-11-2009 07:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ted Todd     Edit/Delete Message
Donna,

You should send an email link to every agency Chief in the state that contains the Dateline Report on CVSA.

Ted

IP: Logged

Taylor
Member
posted 03-11-2009 08:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taylor   Click Here to Email Taylor     Edit/Delete Message
You Tube has the link and I also have the video I was going to burn. There are a bunch of You Tube videos on Polys and CVSA that I have been going trough. If any are real good I will let everyone know.

So - if we don't have a current list of CVSA lawsuits - if anyone knows of a specific case (other than the Prime Time case) will you shoot me an email with the case name/state/# and details if available.

Donna

BTW, I will also check GM's reading room.

IP: Logged

liedoctor
Member
posted 03-12-2009 07:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for liedoctor   Click Here to Email liedoctor     Edit/Delete Message
the only Court case on CVSA misuse I am aware of is the one in Henderson, NV. APA Newsletter, 1999; 32:10

Liedoctor

IP: Logged

jrwygant
Member
posted 03-12-2009 04:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jrwygant   Click Here to Email jrwygant     Edit/Delete Message
Probably the most notorious case was the murder of Stephanie Crowe in California. Her teenage brother and two of his friends were accused of murder. After being told they failed CVSA tests, and then being interrogated aggressively for several hours, two of them made incriminating statements. Two years later DNA evidence identified a drifter schizophrenic, whose sweatshirt had been seized at the time of the crime. He was convicted after a lengthy and costly trial, at which he was entitled to use the arrests of the three boys in his own defense. The police departments all got sued by the boys' families, along with NITV. The judge tossed out the complaints against the police, which remain on appeal. The insurer for NITV paid off in an undisclosed amount. I don't have the case file number handy, but if you use info from the following link you should be able to find it. http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/northcounty/20080611-9999-1m11crowe.html

IP: Logged

Taylor
Member
posted 03-12-2009 04:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Taylor   Click Here to Email Taylor     Edit/Delete Message
FYI I just got this on email
Wisconsin State Journal 3/12/09 http://www.madison.com/wsj/home/local/442598

Jefferson police cancel training on voice-stress analyzer
By DEE J. HALL
608-2523-6132
dhall@madison.com
The city of Jefferson Police Department has cancelled a training session on how to use a controversial voice-stress analyzer after the Wisconsin State Journal raised questions about the technology and the qualifications of the business owner scheduled to conduct the training.

Voice-stress analysis is used by some law enforcement agencies in Wisconsin, including the Jefferson County Sheriff’s Office, to detect “microtremors” in the voice that backers of the technology say indicates speakers are stressed and therefore answering questions deceptively.

Results of such testing aren’t allowed as evidence in court but are used as a “last-resort” investigative tool, said Detective Sgt. Tim Madson of the Jefferson County Sheriff’s Office, whose department uses Computerized Voice Stress Analysis (CVSA). The cancelled training at the Jefferson Police Department was for a similar but less expensive technology, the Digital Voice Stress Analyzer (DVSA).

“If everything has been exhausted in investigative techniques and they have a suspect or someone they want to eliminate as a suspect, it (CVSA) has been used,” Madson said, adding that the technology has prompted confessions from suspects. “The tool works, as far as I’m concerned.”

Until 2007, the Wisconsin Department of Justice’s Division of Criminal Investigation also used voice-stress analysis to interrogate suspects, DOJ spokesman Bill Cosh said.

However, some recent government-backed studies have concluded that the technology isn’t reliable, with one researcher likening the ability of voice-stress analysis to detect deception as no more accurate than “flipping a coin.”

Jefferson Police Chief Gary Bleecker said Wednesday he decided to cancel the weeklong training session, which had been scheduled for June, after the State Journal raised questions about whether the DVSA works. The newspaper also raised questions about E. Gary Baker, a Cape Canaveral, Fla. businessman who markets the Baker DVSA.

Baker uses the title “Dr.” in his promotional materials. Until 2005, Baker’s Web site said he held “earned degrees of Master of Arts in Religious Counseling and Doctor of Philosophy in Theocentric Business and Ethics from American College of Metaphysical Theology.”

Since the group AntiPolygraph.org revealed that the American College of Metaphysical Theology of Golden Valley, Minn., sells PhDs for $249 over the Internet, Baker no longer mentions the college on his Web site. But he continues to tout his “doctor of philosophy” degree on www.bakerdvsa.com.

Baker declined to talk to the State Journal, saying in an e-mail that his Web site “contains all information we care to release to non-law enforcement persons.”

Bleecker said when one of his detectives notified Baker that Jefferson had decided to cancel the $1,500-a-head training, Baker reportedly replied, “Okay.”

“Baker didn’t ask (why),” Bleecker said. “That’s kind of funny. You think he’d ask why. You’d think he’d say, ‘What’s the story?’ That’s a telling sign to me.”

Bleecker said he’s most bothered by Baker’s use of the title “Dr.”

“It raises a lot of questions in my mind,” the chief said, adding, “At this point, I don’t think we need to be involved with something like that (DVSA) with Dr. Baker.”

Cosh said the state justice department stopped using voice-stress analysis after 10 years because of dwindling demand for it by its own agents and other agencies. When it came time to fork out more money for updated training in 2007, he said, the department decided to discontinue it.

“We did use it on our cases, but it was very infrequently,” Cosh said. “By the end, we were using it on about one case a year.”

An article in the 2008 National Institute of Justice Journal summarized findings of an NIJ-funded study about voice-stress analysis technology, finding it correctly indicated deception or truth among drug users just half the time — “no better than flipping a coin.”

The study by Kelly Damphousse and other researchers at the Okahoma Department of Mental Health and Sustance Abuse Services found that the technology correctly detected lies about drug use by more than 300 arrestees just 15 percent of the time, based on contemporaneous urine testing. Another 8.5 percent of respondents who were telling the truth were incorrectly classified as being deceptive, the study found.

However, the study’s authors concluded that the mere presence of voice-stress testing appeared to prompt more people to tell the truth.

“We did find ... that arrestees who were questioned using the VSA instruments were less likely to lie about illicit drug use compared to arrestees whose responses were recorded by the interviewer with pen and paper,” Damphousse wrote in the National Institute of Justice Journal.

Bleecker said his department is out the $1,500 it paid to train one of its officers on the DVSA. The detective’s training class included officers from the Everest, Twin Lakes, Milwaukee, Pulaski, Platteville and Silver Lake police departments, he said.
Shorewood Police Chief David Banaszynski, president of the Wisconsin Chiefs of Police Association, said he doesn’t know how widespread use of voice-stress analysis technology is.

“We do not use the machine, and I really don’t know of anyone in this area that does,” said the suburban Milwaukee police chief.

Said Bleecker: “We’re not going to use it (DVSA). It just leads us down a road that we don’t want to be on.”

IP: Logged

Dan S
Member
posted 03-12-2009 06:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dan S   Click Here to Email Dan S     Edit/Delete Message
Donna

That is very interesting news and very timely. I mentioned something to Don Kraphol about having a copy of the deposition concerning Baker and NITV so if anyone needs a copy, please let me know.

I will also have Robbie send out at least 100 of the Truth vs Myth brochures to you.

On a side note, please advise your members that the Public Agency Training Council, (PATC) will be conducting a 3 day seminar on Interviewing the Sexual Deviant in Sandy, Utah May 11-13th

IP: Logged

ebvan
Member
posted 03-12-2009 08:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ebvan   Click Here to Email ebvan     Edit/Delete Message
Baker's Web Site isn't totally worthless.
His links section has two taxi services and an Oyster Bar. I mean if you are ever in Cocoa Beach

------------------
Ex scientia veritas

[This message has been edited by ebvan (edited 03-12-2009).]

IP: Logged

Toneill
Member
posted 03-13-2009 11:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Toneill   Click Here to Email Toneill     Edit/Delete Message
In Regards to CVSA/DVSA

I just got back from a personal matter in Pennsylvania and prior to leaving fired this up after our agency as well as other law enforcement agencies got a teletype announcing law enforcement sponsored training at the City of Jefferson P.D.

Anyhow here are the emails that I sent off that sparked the interest of Dee Hall a reporter that we have used in the past.

To the sponsoring agency!

Hi Lt,

We as well as others in the law enforcement community received your TTY in regards to City of Jefferson Police Department sponsored training for DVSA through the “Baker Group International”. Separate of the concerns for their product, have you guys checked out Dr. Baker’s credentials?

“He holds earned degrees of Master of Arts in Religious Counseling and Doctor of Philosophy in Theocentric Business and Ethics.”


http://bakerdvsa.com/management.htm

Any questions, give me a call…just surprised by your departments commitment…..

Tony

Anthony J. O'Neill
Detective
Marinette County Sheriff's Department
2161 University Drive
Marinette, Wisconsin 54143
715-732-7621
715-732-7613 (fax)
toneill@marinettecounty.com


I didn't get any reply from the LT !!

Email to Dee Hall!

Dee,

Here is a good story in the making in your area. The City of Jefferson P.D. is sponsoring a 5 day class on Voice Stress Analysis Detection of Deception in June. The group that is presenting it is http://bakerdvsa.com

You have to check out their site and pay attention to the Credentials cited for Mr. Baker…..

Anyhow there is a more in depth review of Baker at


http://antipolygraph.org/cgi-bin/forums/YaBB.pl?board=cvsa;action=display;num=1116418751

I feel bad that any taxpayers money would go to this guy for junk training….

Hope things are well…

Tony

Anthony J. O'Neill
Detective
Marinette County Sheriff's Department
2161 University Drive
Marinette, Wisconsin 54143
715-732-7621
715-732-7613 (fax)
toneill@marinettecounty.com

After this email we talked a bit about CVSA, DVSA, Validity and Reliability issues, Crowe Confession, State of Wisconsin Benching their CVSA's...etc..

Her question was "how does the fed's feel about the CVSA/DVSA and the Crowe Confession, so I gave her Don Krapohl's contact information. I followed it up with an email to Don as well.

Dee sent me this email that I got when I came back today.

Tony: Thanks for the tip! Turns out the Jefferson P.D. now agrees with you.

Here's my story about it in today's paper. http://www.madison.com/wsj/home/local/442598

Dee J. Hall
reporter
Wisconsin State Journal
1901 Fish Hatchery Road
Madison, Wis. 53713
(608) 252-6132
(608) 252-6119 (fa


My bottom line reaction to this is this!

"Below is the email I received from the reporter that I made contact with regarding DVSA. If you follow the link you can read her article. Intervention from my end didn't take much effort. As I mentioned in my previous email, perhaps a pro active rather then re active approach toward cvsa/dvsa etc by the APA and AAPP would pay far more dividends in keeping them out of law enforcement agencies and the taxpayers pockets."

I believe that if we (the polygraph profession) follow through with a proactive approach toward this issue, it will definitely make a difference with not much effort.

Tony

IP: Logged

Toneill
Member
posted 03-14-2009 12:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Toneill   Click Here to Email Toneill     Edit/Delete Message
BTW

If you do some google work you will see that Dr. Baker is offering classes in other states as well.

I also wonder if those endorsing agencies, officials etc are aware of his (Dr. Baker's) insincere claims for his product as well as himself.

Tony

IP: Logged

All times are PT (US)

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | The Polygraph Place

Copyright 1999-2008. WordNet Solutions Inc. All Rights Reserved

Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board, Version 5.39c
© Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998 - 1999.